I recently discovered a form of writing that annoys me even more than badly written accents. It's when the author represents a foreign country or person by using common foreign words.
"Elena stepped into the calle and an automóvil rushed past her, splashing her with mud. She missed the days of the caballo, the days of elegancia..." (Not from an actual book, but you get the idea.
This is so true. I enjoyed the analysis here of how foreigners really use English. I had two French friends and their English was good, but you could hear the French at work in their minds when they chose slightly odd words - for instance, 'I am in advance' instead of 'I am early'. However, that would be hard to understand at a glance in a narrative unless you added another character's thoughts, 'Marie's English was good but you could sometimes hear the French in surprising constructions. She said "in advance" when she meant "early".' (Assuming you have room for all that, which you might not.)
Then there are accents. If you try to render them phonetically they can be really intrusive on the page and get tired very quickly.
Really, the question is, what does the accent/foreignness add to the characters' impact on other people? All characters create an aura, an impression on others. The way they talk is part of this, but there will be other mannerisms as well. Germans will be more forthright and direct than French (this is again from personal experience). This will seem to be part of their personality as much as their language. We should create the impression of the whole person, from their natures as well as their vocal presentation, and their cultures too.
Thank you so much for this - it's super-useful. It's hardest, I find, when I don't have a clue about the mother tongue of the character I'm writing who is speaking English. Google Translate doesn't work well, because its weakest aspect is word-order and grammar, which is the thing which most often goes slightly awry - and yet it's also the thing that you can work with most successfully to evoke the foreignness while making sure the reader still understands what the character is trying to say.
One more thought: one of the reasons to make your characters say a few words in their own language is to get the reader to "hear" the accent, when (as you rightly say) we don't want to write lots of wonky spellings and dropped Hs. The problem is, of course, that the words you can most trust the reader to understand in (say) French, are the words your French character is most likely to know in English. I do think a little sleight-of-hand may be the least-bad option here. A *Bonjour* may not be the *most* likely word to stay in French, but it can be deployed in a good cause...
Indeed, a simple Bonjour to set the tone, then that's plenty. Or, perhaps, flip it. Have an English-speaking say a word or two in a foreign language, then let the conversation carry on in English.
Yes - though it does depend on the scenario. In the historical novel that's being published in the autumn, an important strand of the story is set overnight in a snowed-up mountain hut, with three characters antagonistic in various ways to each other: one speaks French and Luxemburgish, one Luxemburgish and Latin, one Latin and French, but not Luxemburgish - although he does speak Flemish, so can sometimes guess at the latter.
So I had to figure out who was saying what in which language, and then make sure the reader knew, since it *really* mattered to the story.
Okay, that's a complicated one! Reminds me of the time when I was traveling from Italy through Yugoslavia to Greece by train when I was 15. The Yugoslav train inspector only spoke Serbo-Croat, and he was trying to explain something to an elderly passenger who spoke only Dutch. However, I knew a little Russian and a little German, so I used that to try and figure out what they were saying and translate it (badly) into a language the other could sort of understand. Somehow, we managed.
As for yours... write it as a screenplay and use subtitles. :)
I definitely just have my foreign characters talk normally and mention their accent. I wouldn't even dream of trying to write an accent - the horror of getting it wrong and offending those of that language would be embarrassing. This was insightful though with your experience. Thank you for sharing it!
I recently discovered a form of writing that annoys me even more than badly written accents. It's when the author represents a foreign country or person by using common foreign words.
"Elena stepped into the calle and an automóvil rushed past her, splashing her with mud. She missed the days of the caballo, the days of elegancia..." (Not from an actual book, but you get the idea.
Ugh.
Why is that done so frequently? The mix and match?
I guess, because it makes the author and reader feel educated if they can read something in multiple languages.
This is so true. I enjoyed the analysis here of how foreigners really use English. I had two French friends and their English was good, but you could hear the French at work in their minds when they chose slightly odd words - for instance, 'I am in advance' instead of 'I am early'. However, that would be hard to understand at a glance in a narrative unless you added another character's thoughts, 'Marie's English was good but you could sometimes hear the French in surprising constructions. She said "in advance" when she meant "early".' (Assuming you have room for all that, which you might not.)
Then there are accents. If you try to render them phonetically they can be really intrusive on the page and get tired very quickly.
Really, the question is, what does the accent/foreignness add to the characters' impact on other people? All characters create an aura, an impression on others. The way they talk is part of this, but there will be other mannerisms as well. Germans will be more forthright and direct than French (this is again from personal experience). This will seem to be part of their personality as much as their language. We should create the impression of the whole person, from their natures as well as their vocal presentation, and their cultures too.
Oh bummer. Now I have to re-read my novels and prepare to be depressed. (or maybe I'll only be a little depressed).
Thank you so much for this - it's super-useful. It's hardest, I find, when I don't have a clue about the mother tongue of the character I'm writing who is speaking English. Google Translate doesn't work well, because its weakest aspect is word-order and grammar, which is the thing which most often goes slightly awry - and yet it's also the thing that you can work with most successfully to evoke the foreignness while making sure the reader still understands what the character is trying to say.
One more thought: one of the reasons to make your characters say a few words in their own language is to get the reader to "hear" the accent, when (as you rightly say) we don't want to write lots of wonky spellings and dropped Hs. The problem is, of course, that the words you can most trust the reader to understand in (say) French, are the words your French character is most likely to know in English. I do think a little sleight-of-hand may be the least-bad option here. A *Bonjour* may not be the *most* likely word to stay in French, but it can be deployed in a good cause...
Indeed, a simple Bonjour to set the tone, then that's plenty. Or, perhaps, flip it. Have an English-speaking say a word or two in a foreign language, then let the conversation carry on in English.
Yes - though it does depend on the scenario. In the historical novel that's being published in the autumn, an important strand of the story is set overnight in a snowed-up mountain hut, with three characters antagonistic in various ways to each other: one speaks French and Luxemburgish, one Luxemburgish and Latin, one Latin and French, but not Luxemburgish - although he does speak Flemish, so can sometimes guess at the latter.
So I had to figure out who was saying what in which language, and then make sure the reader knew, since it *really* mattered to the story.
Okay, that's a complicated one! Reminds me of the time when I was traveling from Italy through Yugoslavia to Greece by train when I was 15. The Yugoslav train inspector only spoke Serbo-Croat, and he was trying to explain something to an elderly passenger who spoke only Dutch. However, I knew a little Russian and a little German, so I used that to try and figure out what they were saying and translate it (badly) into a language the other could sort of understand. Somehow, we managed.
As for yours... write it as a screenplay and use subtitles. :)
That's always bothered me, and it's one of the reasons I found Seabury Quinn's Jules de Grandin stories so irritating.
But... it's been a while since I read Weirdstone, but isn't Gowther Mossock a Cheshire lad?
You're probably right. It's been years for me too.
I've lately been reading some Kipling and, good storyteller though he is, his predilection for phonetically representing accents can get wearing.
I definitely just have my foreign characters talk normally and mention their accent. I wouldn't even dream of trying to write an accent - the horror of getting it wrong and offending those of that language would be embarrassing. This was insightful though with your experience. Thank you for sharing it!